Optimizing Oracle JD Edwards Licensing Costs: Negotiation and Cost-Saving Strategies

Optimizing Oracle JD Edwards Licensing Costs: Negotiation and Cost-Saving Strategies

Executive Summary:
Enterprise IT leaders often face high costs for Oracle JD Edwards licenses and ongoing support.

This article provides CIOs and procurement heads a roadmap to optimize JD Edwards licensing costs.

We break down the components of JD Edwards’s spending—from upfront license fees to annual support, and share strategies to reduce costs through smart license model choices, contract negotiations, support cost management, and third-party support alternatives.

The focus is on practical, actionable steps to achieve significant savings without risking compliance.

Understanding JD Edwards Licensing Cost Components

Oracle JD Edwards licensing entails two major cost components: perpetual license fees (a one-time purchase cost) and annual support & maintenance fees.

Understanding these is the first step to optimization:

• License Fees (CapEx): These are the upfront costs to buy the rights to use JD Edwards software indefinitely (perpetual use). Oracle’s price list for JD Edwards modules is typically quoted per user or metric. For example, a core module like Financial Management might list around $4,595 per named user license. If you need 100 users, that’s $459,500 at list price. Most enterprises negotiate discounts off these list prices (discussed later), so actual spend may be lower. Some modules or metrics have different pricing (e.g., a Human Resources module could be priced per employee, say $125 per employee). Additionally, Oracle often has a minimum quantity – commonly five named users per module – so even a small deployment requires purchasing a baseline number of licenses.
• Support & Maintenance Fees (OpEx): Customers typically enroll in Oracle’s Annual Support after buying licenses. The standard support fee is 22% of the net license price you paid, charged every year. This gives you access to upgrades, patches, and Oracle support services. However, support isn’t a fixed price – Oracle increases it by a certain uplift percentage annually (historically ~3-4% per year). Over time, this compounding increase means support costs can significantly outgrow your initial license spending. For example, if you pay $1 million in licenses, first-year support is $220,000. With a 4% annual uplift, by year 5, the yearly support fee would be around $257,000. Over a decade, you might pay more in support than the original license cost multiple times.
• Indirect Costs: While not fees paid to Oracle, keep in mind the internal costs associated with licensing. This includes the resources to manage compliance, any true-up purchases if you need more licenses later, and potentially the cost of shelfware (licenses you own but don’t use, yet still pay support on). Reducing these inefficiencies is part of cost optimization, too.

By mapping out these cost elements for your JD Edwards environment, you can clarify where to focus savings efforts. For many organizations, the ongoing support is the largest expense over the long term, so that will be a key area to address.

Choosing the Right License Model for Cost Efficiency

Oracle offers multiple JD Edwards licensing models (user-based, module bundles, enterprise metrics, etc.), and choosing the optimal mix can greatly impact cost.

A one-size-fits-all approach often leads to overspending, so consider these options:

• Application User (Named User) Licensing: This per-user-per-module model is straightforward but can become expensive linearly as you add users. It works best when you have a defined group of users for each module, and you don’t expect huge user count growth. To optimize costs, avoid over-provisioning: don’t buy licenses for users who “might” use the system – buy for actual needed users and then monitor usage. Also, if two modules are used by completely different small user groups, named user licensing per module ensures you pay only for each group, which can be cost-efficient.
• Custom Application Suite (CAS) Licensing: CAS bundles let you license a package of multiple JD Edwards modules for a set number of users. This can save money if the same users require access to many modules. Oracle often gives a bundle discount (for example, instead of buying Financials, Manufacturing, and Inventory separately, you negotiate one CAS price for all three). The key to CAS cost efficiency is alignment: the users in the CAS should truly need all those modules. If not, you end up paying for functionality not everyone uses. When negotiating a CAS, aim for a price lower than the sum of individual module licenses at your discount level. Also, be aware that CAS comes with an “all or nothing” user count – every CAS user counts for every module in the bundle, so plan that number carefully.
• Enterprise Metric Licensing: Sometimes, you can license JD Edwards based on a business metric like employee count or revenue (unlimited users). This might seem pricey upfront (e.g., $125 per employee for an HR module, meaning $625k for 5,000 employees), but it can be cost-effective if almost everyone in the company needs at least some access. It eliminates the need to buy incremental user licenses as you grow, until you hit the next metric tier. To optimize enterprise licenses, negotiate a metric that makes sense (if you’re licensing by employees, clarify if all contractors are counted, etc., and perhaps negotiate a buffer so slight growth doesn’t immediately force a purchase). Enterprise licensing shines cost-wise in broad use scenarios, but a per-user model might be cheaper if only a small fraction of employees use the system.
• Legacy Concurrent User Licenses: If you have them from earlier contracts, concurrent licenses allow multiple people to share a pool of licenses, potentially reducing the total needed if not all users are on simultaneously. Oracle doesn’t sell these new versions for JD Edwards, but some companies still operate under them. If so, maximize their value by actively monitoring concurrent usage and ensuring you stay below the cap. A well-tuned concurrent environment (like 150 named people sharing 100 concurrent licenses) can be cost-efficient if managed correctly (no uncontrolled login spikes). However, if you’re constantly at the concurrent limit, the cost benefit vanishes, and you may need to add licenses or transition to named users.

Often, the best cost strategy is a hybrid approach: for example, use named user licenses for most modules but an enterprise metric for something like Employee Self-Service, which everyone in the company might access occasionally.

Or maintain some legacy concurrent licenses for a specific shift-based group while new users are added as named. Analyze usage patterns module by module, and don’t be afraid to mix models to minimize total spend.

Negotiating Discounts and Contract Terms

Never pay Oracle’s full list price – significant discounts are the norm in enterprise deals. Negotiation is your strongest tool to reduce JD Edwards licensing costs upfront:

• Leverage Your Purchase Volume: Oracle’s discounting typically scales with the size of the deal. You can push for a steep discount if you’re making a substantial investment (say a bundle of multiple modules or many users). Large enterprises commonly secure 50% or more of the list price. Even smaller purchases can often get 20-30% off. Use Oracle’s quarter-end or fiscal year-end to your advantage, when sales teams are keen to close deals – they may offer better pricing.
• Bundle and Save: If you have other Oracle needs (Database, Cloud services, etc.), consider negotiating JD Edwards as part of a bigger package. Oracle might be more flexible on application license pricing if it sees a bigger strategic deal. However, evaluate each component carefully – sometimes Oracle will give with one hand and take with the other. Ensure the JD Edwards portion is appropriately discounted and not offset by another product’s lesser deal.
• Cap or Freeze Support Uplifts: While Oracle is reluctant to reduce the 22% support rate, you can negotiate how that support fee grows. Ask for a cap on annual support increases (for example, “support fees will not increase by more than 3% annually for the next 5 years”). Some customers have even obtained a temporary freeze (0% increase for a couple of years), especially if they simultaneously commit to a new license purchase. Locking in predictable support costs can save a lot over the long term. This needs to be written into the contract or ordering document.
• Negotiate Price Holds for Future Purchases: If you anticipate needing more JD Edwards licenses in the future (due to company growth or new modules), try to include a clause that guarantees the same discount or unit price for a certain period. For instance, “Additional Financials application user licenses purchased within 2 years will receive the same 50% discount.” This prevents Oracle from leveraging a high list price later when you’re in a pinch.
• Beware of Repricing Clauses: Oracle’s contracts often include clauses that if you terminate support on some licenses, the remaining support bill can be recalculated at current rates (often erasing the savings). When negotiating, see if you can get some flexibility, or at least be fully aware of the implications. For example, if you plan on dropping a module in the future, ask how it will impact support on your other licenses – perhaps negotiate that the support base won’t fall below a certain floor rather than full repricing.
• Document Special Terms: If Oracle makes verbal promises (like “we won’t charge back-support if you true-up within 30 days of growth” or “you can repurpose licenses from module A to B if you switch”), get it in writing. Any cost-related promises should be codified in the contract. Oracle is a stickler for the written contract during audits and negotiations, so your protections must live there.

A successful negotiation can dramatically reduce the upfront cost and prevent nasty surprises later. It’s worth the time and involvement of senior leadership to push for the best terms, as these contracts will define your spend for years to come.

Managing and Reducing Ongoing Support Costs

Support fees are often the largest part of JD Edwards’ total ownership cost. Some strategies to manage or cut these ongoing costs include:

• Regularly Identify Shelfware: Each year (before your support renewal), review what licenses you’re using. If you have licenses for a module you no longer use, or far more users than are active, you have “shelfware.” You could consider retiring those licenses to drop support costs. However, this should be approached carefully because of Oracle’s repricing policy. Oracle won’t let you drop half your licenses and cut your support bill by 50%. Typically, if you terminate support on a subset of licenses, Oracle will reprice the rest at the current list price, effectively wiping out much of the savings. For example, if you had 100 user licenses and drop 50, Oracle might recalculate support on the remaining 50 as if no discount applied, meaning you save little. To avoid this trap, work with Oracle to get a quote for what support would be after dropping licenses, before you execute any termination. Sometimes it’s not financially worth it, and you might be better off keeping the shelfware or finding a way to use those licenses productively.
• Optimize License Allocation: Rather than having shelfware in the first place, institute processes to reallocate licenses. If one division stopped using JD Edwards, you could transfer those licenses to another project instead of buying new ones. Oracle licenses are generally global within the legal entity, so make sure that any new need checks the pool of existing licenses first internally. This ensures you maximize utilization of what you’ve already paid for (and are paying support).
• Third-Party Support Providers: For organizations looking to dramatically cut costs, third-party support firms (such as Rimini Street) offer maintenance for JD Edwards at roughly 50% of Oracle’s support fee. If you engage a third-party, you typically stop paying Oracle support (which means no more updates from Oracle). Companies often choose this when JD Edwards is stable in their environment and they don’t plan to upgrade versions frequently. Third-party support can save millions over time and often provides very responsive service. The trade-offs: you won’t receive new patches or official enhancements from Oracle, and if Oracle releases a tax/legal update or a security fix, you won’t get it unless your third-party provider delivers an alternative. Also, if you ever plan to resume Oracle support or upgrade to a new JD Edwards version, you might have to back-pay Oracle support or purchase new licenses. In short, this route is best for organizations on a steady-state JD Edwards deployment looking to reduce cost. It’s a strategic decision and should be weighed carefully, but it can yield substantial savings (maintenance bills cut in half, and avoidance of forced upgrades).
• Maximize Value If You Stay on Oracle Support: Many CIOs will stick with Oracle’s support for risk management. In that case, ensure you get your money’s worth. Use the support services actively – log tickets for issues, download all patches, leverage Oracle’s knowledge base and any included tools. If you’re paying 22% annually, treat it as an investment: ensure your JD Edwards environment is updated with the latest fixes and your team engages Oracle Support for troubleshooting to reduce other operational costs. Also, Oracle has committed to supporting JD Edwards through at least 2036, so you should receive periodic Tools updates or minor enhancements – plan to apply those to keep your system modern (since you’re funding it via support fees). This doesn’t directly cut costs, but it increases the ROI of those support dollars, which is an important part of cost optimization thinking.

Managing support costs is often about the long game: small percentage uplifts compound, and unnecessary spend on unused licenses drags year after year.

You can bend the cost curve by actively managing your support contract and exploring alternatives.

Example: Five-Year Support Cost Scenario

To illustrate the impact of support optimization, consider an example of a company with $1,000,000 in JD Edwards licenses (net after discount), which yields a $220,000 first-year support fee (22%).

Suppose Oracle’s standard 8% annual support increase applies. Compare the five-year spend if staying with Oracle versus switching to a third-party support at 50% cost with no increases:

In this scenario, using third-party support would save around $641,000 over five years, more than 50% of support costs. However, remember the intangible costs: no new Oracle versions or patches.

For some, the savings outweigh this; for others, the risk doesn’t.

The key for CIOs is to crunch the numbers for their cases and decide on a path that balances cost savings with technical needs.

Ongoing License Management and Future Planning

Cost optimization isn’t a one-time project—it’s an ongoing practice. Here are ways to ensure your JD Edwards licensing remains cost-efficient in the long run:

• Governance for New Deployments: Any time a new JD Edwards module or functionality is proposed, involve your asset management team in the approval process. Evaluate whether you have spare licenses or will need to buy more, and budget accordingly. This prevents unplanned purchases and lets you perhaps consolidate needs into a single negotiation (getting a better discount).
• Monitor Usage Trends: Use system reports to observe if certain modules’ user counts are trending up or down. If one area of the business is scaling up JD Edwards usage quickly, plan for a true-up before it surpasses entitlements. Conversely, if a business unit is shrinking or a process is being retired, you might reclaim licenses.
• Contract Renewal Strategy: When your support renewal or license agreement anniversaries come up, treat them as a chance to renegotiate. Oracle may be amenable to adjustments if you’re also considering alternative options. For instance, at renewal, you could negotiate swapping some unused module licenses for ones you need (Oracle sometimes allows license exchanges under certain circumstances, which can optimize your spend). Also, re-assess your support needs – if you’re considering third-party support, renewal time is often when organizations make that switch.
• Keep an Eye on Oracle’s Product Roadmap: Oracle’s strategic direction can influence costs. If Oracle strongly encourages moving to its Cloud ERP, it might offer special deals or credits to transition. While deciding to move off JD Edwards is big beyond just licensing, it’s good to know what incentives exist. In some cases, Oracle has offered cloud subscription credits in exchange for on-prem licenses. As a cost-savvy leader, stay informed about these programs; even if you don’t use them, they give you leverage (“We could move to the cloud with a big discount, so maybe keep my JD Edwards support low to retain us”).
• Periodic Benchmarking: Compare your JD Edwards licensing costs with industry benchmarks or similar Oracle customers (if such info is available via user groups or consultants). This can reveal if you’re overpaying. For instance, if you find that the most similar firms get a 60% discount and you only get 30%, you know to push harder in the next negotiation. Oracle licensing is notorious for customer-specific deals, so doing this homework can uncover negotiation opportunities.

By treating JD Edwards license management as an ongoing program rather than a set-and-forget purchase, you will continuously find opportunities to save money or at least get more value for what you spend.

Recommendations

• Align Licenses to Actual Use: Conduct regular usage reviews to ensure you’re not paying for more licenses or support than needed. Immediately address any “license shelfware” – repurpose those licenses or discuss terminating support on them (with full understanding of Oracle’s policies).
• Use the Optimal Metrics: Tailor the license model to each module’s usage. For broadly used functions, enterprise metrics can cap costs. For niche use, stick to named users. Don’t assume one license type is cheapest for everything.
• Negotiate Everything: Don’t accept standard terms by default. Negotiate upfront discounts aggressively, and push for contract terms that limit long-term cost (support uplift caps, locked-in discounts for future purchases, etc.). The best time to gain concessions is before signing the deal or renewal.
• Manage Support Proactively: Treat the annual support bill as something that can be influenced. For example, negotiate multi-year support terms, and if costs grow too high, be willing to bring up the option of third-party support as leverage – Oracle might respond with a better offer to keep your support business.
• Consider Third-Party Support for Stable Environments: If your JD Edwards system is not undergoing new implementations or heavy changes, evaluate third-party support providers. Many CIOs have saved 50%+ on support, reallocating that budget to other initiatives. Ensure leadership understands the trade-offs (no new Oracle patches/upgrades).
• Plan License Needs in Advance: When you know growth or new projects will require more JD Edwards users or modules, engage Oracle early. Negotiating additional licenses is better when you’re not under pressure (or audit). Early negotiation can yield better discounts and perhaps entirely avoid a compliance issue.
• Keep Contracts and Records Organized: Maintain a clear inventory of your Oracle contracts, what you’ve purchased, and key terms. Many cost leaks happen because organizations lose track of what they have. A well-documented contract repository helps you avoid buying unnecessary licenses and ensures you leverage all rights (like using dev/test licenses that may be included).
• Watch for Oracle Licensing Policy Changes: Oracle occasionally adjusts licensing rules or pricing. Stay updated via Oracle announcements or industry experts. For example, if Oracle changes how JD Edwards is sold or introduces a new bundle, it might create an opportunity to reduce costs (or a risk of cost increase). Being aware lets you act or negotiate accordingly.
• Internal Awareness and Training: Ensure that your procurement and IT teams know the high cost of licensing and the importance of optimization. Sometimes, line-of-business managers might request software without understanding the impact of license costs. Having a governance process and educated managers helps prevent cost overruns.
• Engage with JD Edwards User Groups: Other customers can share successful cost-saving measures (for instance, how they negotiated a certain term or experiences with third-party support). This peer knowledge can inspire new strategies for your organization and give you data points to use in negotiations with Oracle.

FAQ

Q1: How much discount off list price can we realistically get on JD Edwards licenses?
A: It depends on your negotiating leverage and deal size. Large enterprises buying a significant number of licenses or multiple products have reported discounts in the 50-70% range off Oracle’s list prices. Smaller purchases might see 20-40%. The key is negotiating assertively and perhaps time purchases with Oracle’s sales targets (end of quarter/year). Oracle sales reps expect customers to negotiate, so always counter the initial quote. Having competitive insights or using a consultant who knows Oracle’s discounting practices can also help you aim high.

Q2: Oracle says support is 22% of the license fee – can we negotiate that percentage lower?
A: Oracle rarely lowers the standard support percentage for on-premise licenses – 22% is a global policy. You can gain insight into how that 22% is applied. For example, if you negotiated a 50% discount on the licenses, your support is 22% of the discounted price (good). But Oracle sometimes tries to calculate support on the list price even if you got a discount (“price hold” basis) – you should ensure your contract says support is based on net fees paid. Also, you might negotiate a delay (e.g., first year of support free, effectively a one-time discount) or a cap on annual increases as discussed. So while the rate stays 22%, the effective support cost over time can be influenced through those methods.

Q3: We have some JD Edwards modules that hardly anyone uses. Is it worth dropping those to save money?
A: Potentially, yes – if you’re paying support on a module that provides little value, that’s low-hanging fruit to cut. However, approach it strategically. Calculate the support cost for that module (if your contracts break it out; if not, perhaps by license proportional value). Then get a quote from Oracle for support after terminating that module. If Oracle reprices the rest, you might see that the net savings are small or zero. One alternative is to negotiate a conversion – Oracle might allow you to swap those unused licenses for licenses of another module that you need, which could be a better outcome than just dropping. Don’t continue paying indefinitely for software you don’t use; at minimum, bring it up with Oracle at renewal to explore options.

Q4: Our company is growing quickly. How do we ensure we don’t get a huge bill later for additional JD Edwards users?
A: Planning is essential. Suppose you anticipate growth (like hiring 200 more employees who will use JD Edwards). In that case, you have a few options: 1) Pre-purchase some extra licenses now at your current discount – this might qualify for a volume discount and lock pricing so that you won’t pay more later. 2) Negotiate a contractual provision for expansion as mentioned earlier, so you can buy more at a set price. 3) If growth is uncertain, keep a close eye on user counts and maybe negotiate an ad-hoc deal mid-year once you’re sure of the need (rather than waiting for an audit). Oracle will gladly sell you more licenses; the trick is to do it on your timeline and budget, not as a panic buy. Communicate with Oracle – sometimes they’ll offer a deal like a bundle of 100 licenses at a discount before you actually need all 100, knowing you likely will. It can save money versus buying 20 here, 20 there later at lesser discounts.

Q5: What is Oracle’s repricing policy, and how does it affect cost savings?
A: Oracle’s repricing policy essentially says that if you drop support on some licenses, the support on your remaining licenses may be recalculated as if you had only bought those remaining ones. This is Oracle’s way of preventing customers from shaving off licenses to cut costs. For example, you bought 100 licenses at 50% off, paying $2M (list $4M) and $440k/yr support. If you drop 50 licenses, you’d think support would drop to $220k. But Oracle might say, now you have 50 licenses, if you originally had just bought 50, maybe they’d only have given 30% off – so they reprice those 50 at, say, $3.15M list value with 30% off = $2.2M net, and 22% of that is ~$484k. So you’d end up paying more for support on 50 licenses than on 100! This is why dropping licenses often doesn’t save money. To get real savings, you must negotiate with Oracle to waive or mitigate repricing – not easy, but sometimes possible for minor reductions. Or consider third-party support where repricing is a non-issue (because you’re leaving Oracle support entirely). The existence of this policy means any plan to reduce licenses needs a careful cost analysis.

Q6: Are there lower-cost license types for casual JD Edwards users?
A: Oracle’s standard offering now is just the full Application User license per module. They don’t openly sell “read-only” or “casual user” licenses for JD Edwards in modern price lists. However, some older contracts (and other Oracle products like PeopleSoft) had limited use licenses – e.g., an Inquiry User that can only view data, at a lower price. If your JD Edwards agreement includes something like “Inquiry user” or “Self-Service user,” you should utilize those for the appropriate users because they cost less. Oracle might not advertise it, but if you have tens or hundreds of users who only need read-only access, discuss with your Oracle rep if a limited-use license is available. Sometimes Oracle will agree to sell a subset of licenses with restricted use at a lower price on a case-by-case basis, especially if it prevents a scenario where you might not license those users due to cost. Always weigh the administrative complexity of policing the restrictions, though – a user with a cheaper license must not perform actions outside their allowed scope, or you’ll be non-compliant.

Q7: What about hosting JD Edwards on cloud infrastructure – does it affect licensing costs?
A: Running JD Edwards on a cloud (like AWS, Azure, or Oracle’s OCI) doesn’t change the JD Edwards application licensing since those are user- or metric-based and are not tied to hardware. You can bring your JD Edwards licenses to any infrastructure (on-prem servers or cloud VMs) with no additional fees to Oracle for that move. There are more cost considerations about your infrastructure cost, not Oracle licensing. One caution: JD Edwards uses an Oracle Database in the back end – database licensing has its own rules on cloud (especially on AWS/Azure regarding vCPU to Oracle core calculations). Make sure your Oracle database licenses are compliant in a cloud environment. But regarding JD Edwards app licenses, you won’t pay Oracle more to run it in the cloud. Some companies use that to reduce hardware TCO while using the same licenses. Oracle does offer a SaaS called Oracle Fusion Cloud ERP as a replacement for JD Edwards; switching to that is a whole new licensing model (subscription per user) and usually costs more in the short term, though Oracle might pitch long-term savings and modernization. Many JD Edwards customers stick with their on-prem licenses and perhaps just re-host on cloud IaaS for better flexibility – that move doesn’t incur new Oracle license charges.

Q8: If we switch to third-party support, can we return to Oracle support later?
A: It’s possible, but it can be expensive. Oracle’s policy is if you lapse support and later want updates or to upgrade to a newer version, you have to pay for the “missing” years of support (the back support), plus possibly a reinstatement fee. In practice, many who leave Oracle support treat it as a permanent decision for that product or until they move off it entirely. For example, some customers negotiate with Oracle to waive maintenance fees if they migrate to Oracle’s cloud offering. But if you plan to use third-party support for 5 years and then go back to Oracle support to get an upgrade, you should budget for a potentially large one-time cost or consider buying new licenses (which might even be cheaper in some cases than back-paying). Each situation is unique, so engage Oracle on options if you foresee needing to go back. The savings from third-party support can still outweigh this if you only plan an upgrade infrequently (like once a decade).

Q9: How can we reduce costs to expand JD Edwards usage to a new module?
A: When adding a new module, consider a few approaches: Check if it can be bundled into an existing CAS (if you have a Custom Application Suite, sometimes you can amend it to include an extra module for a negotiated fee rather than full price standalone licenses). Alternatively, see if Oracle offers a promotional deal – for example, if you’re already a JD Edwards customer, Oracle might offer a discount to adopt an under-utilized module. Always negotiate the new module purchase in the context of your existing investment: remind Oracle how much you’re already paying in support annually (which they want to preserve) and use that as leverage to get a better price. If the budget is tight, you could explore whether a limited subset of users will use the module and maybe limit the scope of licenses initially (start small and grow later). Oracle sales will try to sell big numbers, but you can start with the minimum necessary and add more later to reduce costs. Remember any minimum purchase requirements for that module (Oracle may say “minimum 10 users”, etc.).

Q10: Is an Unlimited License Agreement (ULA) or other Oracle licensing programs for JD Edwards worth considering?
A: Oracle ULAs are typically for technology products (Database, Middleware) rather than applications like JD Edwards. Oracle hasn’t commonly offered ULAs specifically for JD Edwards licensing. They might have some programs for large enterprise application suites, but it’s uncommon. If your Oracle account team proposes some all-you-can-use deal for JD Edwards, scrutinize it – it could be expensive and only for a limited set of products. More relevant might be Oracle offering cloud transition deals (e.g., to move to Oracle Cloud ERP). In general, sticking to and optimizing the traditional license model as discussed is the straightforward path for JD Edwards. Focus on negotiating good discounts and terms in the standard model. ULAs or unlimited deals for JD Edwards are rare, and unless you plan a massive deployment suddenly, they likely won’t be cost-effective. It’s better to keep flexibility and only buy what you need.

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